Archive for August 4th, 2006
Not pissed off. Bored to tears. The home of lockstep robots going nowhere.
Comment by joe rorke
******** Hey, Joe, here’s a novel idea:
******* Why don’t YOU say something interesting?
We have all these search engines, butnone of htem can answer a straightforward question.
So I talked about the absurd term “aristocracy” nd coined the wor “naciocracy.” Classical scholars actedlike they didn’t hear me when I asked them about it and absently answered, “That sounds good.”
So I predicted LibAnon would give me the answer, and he did.
Try asking a search engine a question like that!
So I just talked about he agape and got a mountain of information from Pain.
Pain says Agape means “charity.” Wikipedia says it means “love.” It could mean both.
Pain says that Arianism got its strongest foothold among the Goths. I know that the Goths WERE Arian, but his conradition does not hold. The apostle to the Goths was Wulfila, “little wolf,” a Goth who studied under Arius. He translated the New Testament into his native Gothic.
Pain’s statements on Arius’s real beliefs are enlightening to me.
I overstated it when I said Arius just looked on Jesus as just a prophet. I thought he said Jesus was between God and man.
I am even interested in those Nestorian Christians that had such a huge influence in China. I undersand they were Arian “heretics.”
Maybe I’m wrong about both. Maybe Islam and Arianism seem to have no relationship to the latest press releases, but they are more relevant than Bush’s foot odor. You don’t understand the Middle East by quoting the latest news or bitching about how silly their Paradise is.
Joe Rorke may see all this as boring. But what I am trying to understand is the present Middle East
Joe, hit BACK!
It would be more exciting for me to breathlessly announce the latest Bush attitude towards Iran, but I am more interested in the Zoraostrian background of Shiitism, the deeply different outlooks of Islam versus our world view.
“From what I can understand through all the rewritten history, today’s Mass was formerly the Agape, the Love Feast.”
This is a common mistake made by certain sects. The Agape was separate and distinct from the Eucharist. The Agape or “Love feast” was a charity dinner (agape = “charity”) held for anyone of the public. It was free food provided for the poor and anyone who wanted it, Christian or not. The Agape was just like a Baptist church service with a potluck immediately afterwards. The Agape was one important means for preaching the Gospel to non-believers but the Eucharist was reserved for baptized Christians.
The Eucharist was very different, although both had the prayers, hymns, and a sermon. In the Agape, the meal was normal, earthly food (all you can eat) to fill the stomach. In the Eucharist, the meal was ritual, spiritual food (a piece of bread and a swallow of wine) enabling man to commune with God. The earliest Eucharist would have been very much like a high church Anglican/Episcopalian, Roman Catholic, or Orthodox Eucharist. There is no reason an Agape could not follow Eucharist, just as a potluck might follow one today.
Both services were presided over by the priests, and as CS Lewis rights, the Church never had priestesses. Granted one assumes that women cooked the food, thus it was them that everyone must have thanked gratefully. The priest may have given an inspiring sermon, but it always she who cooks the food that gets our special love and favor.
Over time, the Agape love feast fell out of use since it had come to be abused by those getting free food everyday who did not need the charity.
“The Middle East was never purged of Arianism. Between Constantine and the rise of Island there was one long war in which the Grreks tried to impose the Trinitarian idea on churches inthe Middle East.”
Arian had its strongest foothold among the Goths. Arius did NOT preach that Jesus was just a man or a prophet. He taught that he was God, but a being created at some time in eternity past. Nicea corrected that to say that Jesus as God was eternal, not created, and thus “begotten not made.” The east that you spoke about actually developed their Christology in opposition to Arius.
The Nestorians of Babylon and the Far East accepted that Jesus was divine, but that he was two separate persons, one divine and one human. Orthodoxy taught that Jesus was just one person with both divine and human natures. The Antiochenes that feuded so much with the rest of orthodoxy believed in essentially the same orthodox view but worded it differently to set themselves apart from the Nestorian heretics with whom they had to deal.
The view that Jesus was not divine is common to Islam and modern cults such as the Adventists and Jehovah’s Witnesses. (Mormons believe that Jesus was not divine in the same way as God the Father, but was a man who became divine as a model for men to become divine and get their own planets and populate them with their wives; the children in turn get their own planets in an endless cosmic pyramid scheme.)
Comment by Pain
When I first read “Portnoy’s Complaint” I was interested in Portnoy’s bemoaning the fact that he had it so tough despite all the good things he had done. I had had a lifetime of being taught that a white gentile who did anything for white gentiles was being bigoted and selfish. But every single thing Portnoy listed as what he had done had been done for JEWS.
He had helped JEWISH relief. He had fought Gerald L.K. Smith’s anti-Semitism, he had supported his synogogue and on and on and on.
Nobody sees anything odd about Emma Lazarus and Alan Derschowitz endlessly talking about two things: How white gentiles must be in the melting pot and how Jews must be preserved.
It is taken for granted by Jews that doing good means doing good for Jews.
Many of us, at some time in our lives, have sympathized with the Jewish determination to survive. We have hoped that Jews will someday unite with us in a joint effort to preserve our kind. But this ignores a basic fact about the Jewish outlook. As David Duke keeps pointing out, Jews survive on hostility. The only reason there ARE Jews outside of Israel is because for two millennia they have assumed that everyone around them is out to destroy them.
This is a self-fulfilling prophecy. If you treat everyone around you as an Evil Enemy you will soon find that everybody around you IS your enemy.
Jews are unlike other groups in that their determination to survive is a SECONDARY motivation, and it always will be.
Their FIRST motivation is the assumption that any loyalty that is not to Jews must be destroyed. This primary drive is too deeply entrenched to be cured.
Mark hit back at Joe for saying I was boring with the following:
This is not boring, man — this is white-knuckle-fascinating!!!
Comment by Mark
***** Mark, what happened was that Joe Rorke discovered that I DON’T have that fatal disease I mentioned in “I’m DOOMED!”
***** So he’s p****d off and he’s making up for lost time.
Apeaking of Joe Rorke’s bashful commentaries, I might that mderpelding also goes out of his way to flatter me.
In reply to “Al Parker” below, where I admitted my lack of computer expertise, mderpelding said:
Victimization does not become you.
Comment by mderpelding
My commenters in general have from time to time shown the blindly worshipful attitude Joe and mderpelding demonstrate here.
From time to time someone says I just want everybody to agree with me and praise me. There’s something to that. Somewhere deep in his soul, no matter how he denies it, every preachy old man thinks everybody should agree with him.
But if that is what Bob’s Blog is about, my commenters simply refuse to get with the program.
Victimization does not
Comment by mderpelding
I am pleased to announce we have TWO Joes now.
Joe Rorke just sent me five separate comments on five of the pieces below:
Boring doesn’t even begin to describe this.
Comment by joe rorke
Comment by joe rorke —
Comment by joe rorke
I’m not sure this can get much more boring than this. Hopefully, I’ll get lucky and this honky will delete me.
Comment by Joe Rorke
A jelly donut!!! Are jelly donuts allowed in the barracks, private pyle???
Comment by joe rorke
The problem with Joe is that he is so tied up with being subtle and diplomatic that he just won’t say what he thinks. You know, these guys who hold it all in that way eventually go beserk, so I’m worried about him.
I just received a PM on Stormfront telling me how charming it is that I make jokes about my lack of sexual experience and my limited knowledge on the subject.
My answer was,
“Yes, I am very modest.”
“But I have lot to be modest ABOUT.”
I hope this doesn’t make readers jealous.
People always talk about all the Jews who disappeared from Nazi Germany during World War II. There is another missing group no one EVER talks about.
I am told they are now appearing in WWII movies, but I don’t watch WWII movies.
When the American Heroes of Normandy hit the coast a major portion of them, I have heard half, dropped their “weapons” — a Real Man doesn’t call it a gun or a rifle.
If you ask somebody who has been in fighting whether he ever killed anyody, his usual answer is “I don’t know.” But if he says “YES!” he is almost invariably a member of the group that calls iself The Greatest Generation.
It is interesting to note that almose every member of “The Greatest Generation” killed the enemy personally AND liberated a concentration camp. One general estimated that about 10 to 15% of the American soldiers in action did some 80% of the actual fighting. For some reason, those are the OLY ones I ever meet.
What happened to the guys who dropped their “weapons?” What happened to the other 85 to 90%? How did the concentration camps HOLD all those hundreds of thousands of GIs who liberated them?
History refuses to give me a reply.
In response to the last sentence of my last peice, Shari says,
I don’t see where you are violating any myth that I need to believe. There are many things known, unknown, forgotten, lied about etc. We have a wedding today! Our blue eyed, blond but balding son is marrying Lindsay with sandy red hair, big blue eyes and pale complexion. How’s that?
Comment by Shari
******* Important things first: Congratulations and thanks for our race!
****** On the “myth that they need to believe,” this was not aimed at Shari. You have never discouraged me from talking about the political history of Christianity. Shari, don’t put yourself in that sort of company. It is a scurvy crew. The Tradtional Christianity thread on Stormfront is full of them, and I am sick and tried of being yelled at there every time I try to talk about Christian history, which is an integral part of Traditional Christianity.
***** I like to feel a certain kinship to Jesus the man, whether he was or was not God. If you read what he said and know he was speaking in a society where a man who said hte wrong thing col dbe stoned to death on the spot, if you cut through all the endless Old Testament trappings and endless theological commentary, he keeps saying that one should cut all the crap and be good to others and be worthy, personally, of salvation.
***** That is why, through all the endless bells and whistles and Old Testament baggage, even athiests STILL put Jesus in a special place. That Zoroastrian sickness mpelding denounces is totally absent in the ACTUAL WORDS Jesus spoke. Not one word did he speak against normal sex.
***** That was the Gospel missionaries brought to our ancestors. That seven hundred thousand words of sick baggage called the OT was not part of it. That Zoroastrian sickness that said this world was all evil and a person had to spend his life starving and whipping himself and being sterile was not part of it. His message, to me, was that we should cut all the crap and get back to THAT.
****** But the baggage has drowned the faith. Now Christianity is all Man is Vile and self-destruction and paying out your tithe for the new church building. Whatever Jesus meant when he built his church on Peter, he did NOT build his church in brick or stone. But when I talk about that the “Christians” form an instant lynch mob.
****** One thing no one here can understand is that I am a Bible Belter. I have seen a Bible Belt ATHEIST almost get into a fight with a Yankee who insulted Jesus. Even a Bible Belt atheist knows his Bible. He sees a Jesus who was trying to cut through the crap, and the crap he was denouncing in the Temple Priesthood was twenty feet deep and counting.
****** We see the Temple Priesthood climbing all over him exactly the same way today.
***** I am NOT the Voice of Objective Truth. I am Bob Whitaker. “Traditional Christians” denounce me for insulting the baggage we have loaded Christ with. Those here who see the sickness Christian baggage has wrought denounce me for having anything good to say about Jesus. For hte latter group, the Voice of Objective Truth is not SUPPOSED to have Bible Belt roots, Bible Belt prejudices, Bible Belt reactions. Bob DOES.
**** I am not expressing Objective Truth. I am being honest with you about how BOB looks at things. That includes my circuit rider grandfather. That includes a respect for the real germ of the faith that kept my ancestors going through all the horrors of founding and conquering this continent.
***** Give me some breathing room, gang! I know both Testaments. I know about Zoroastrianism. I see the flaws in that and the OT bagage better than anybody I know. I criticize it enough to infuriate the self-styled Traditional Christians.
****** But I also respect the germs of truth there enough to infuriate those who concentrate only on the disasters it has caused.
****** I insult and infuriate EVERYBODY who wants to be insulted and infuriated.
****** And that last sentence, more than anything else, may indicate that I have something important to say.