Odin hung on the World Tree, Yggsradil, and lost an eye for KNOWLEDGE, not Wisdom.
Yes, Virginia, there have always been different word in Norse tongues for knowledge and for wisdom.
In the Orient, no one in any Holy Book ever cared about just knowing a few more FACTS, which is what knowledge is.
Odin is hte only god I have ever heard of who took knowledge seriously.
Except for Jehovah, JHVH, G*d.
The whole point of Genesis is that the pursuit of knowledge is the one Evil that damns humanity.
It is facinating that Lucifer means “Light Giver.” Satan is also “The Morning Star.”
In Greek mythology Prometheus is the light giver. He gave man the secret of fire and will spend eternity having his guts torn at by birds of prey for that sin.
Original Sin is eating of the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge by Adam and Eve.
These differences in the fundamental thinking of Greeks, Jew-Christians, and Nordics are not exactly trivial.
Any comments?
#1 by Shari on 05/15/2006 - 5:32 pm
Isn’t the whole point of Genesis a test? To see who would be loved and trusted ? Not seeking knowledge is what damns us. We don’t know the outcome if Adam and Eve had obeyed. That might come under the heading of knowledge perhaps learned some day. As for the Greeks , I don’t know. The gods didn’t love us.
#2 by Mark on 05/15/2006 - 7:29 pm
“Isn’t the whole point of Genesis a test? To see who would be loved and trusted ?”
Why would a god who supposedly knows everything and sees everything, is omnipotent and omnipresent have to test anyone? And why would he pass judgement on an entire race simply for the “crimes” of two people? It’s kind of like serving jail time for a crime your great grandparents committed, which is just plain silly.
Could it be that the jewish god is really a make believe, man made god, born of his creator’s insuffficincies?
#3 by Peter on 05/15/2006 - 9:31 pm
“Odin hung on the World Tree, Yggsradil, and lost an eye for KNOWLEDGE, not Wisdom.”
FYI only. This doesn’t take away form your point:
En undir theiri rót er til hrímthursa horfir, thar er Mímis brunnr, er spekdh ok manvit er í folgit, ok heitir sá Mímir er á brunninn. Hann er fullr vísindum fyrir thví at hann drekkr ór brunninum ag horninu Gjallarhorni. Thar kom Alfödhr ok beiddisk eins drykkr af brunninum, en hann fekk eigi fyrr en hann lagdhi auga sitt at vedhi.
Which means:
And under the root which to the rimethurses stretcheth is Mimir’s spring wherein insight and good sense are hidden. And it is named for Mimir whose spring it is. He is full of wisdom, for he drinketh from the spring out of the horn Yellinghorn. Thither came All-Father and bade one drink of the well, but he got it not until he had left an eye on loan.
Thus wisdom is defined as “insight and good sense (man-wit).”
#4 by kane on 05/15/2006 - 9:50 pm
Buddhism is about detaching from the world (the guy was white btw). Confucism is about learning the dynamics of authority (supposidly he went through life learning what needs to be learned so you don’t need to learn it for yourself). I can’t varify your statements about odinism. But I can pretty much verify that this “go get it” attitude is uniquely American, even Europe doesn’t do it the same. Our founding fathers left Europe because they wanted to be able to persue that attitude.
#5 by Derek on 05/15/2006 - 10:11 pm
Is it that seeking knowledge is not evil? That the old mythology was used stagnate us?
#6 by Twin Ruler on 05/16/2006 - 3:07 pm
Science comes from the Latin word “Scientia”, which means knowledge.
#7 by Shari on 05/16/2006 - 3:12 pm
It’s common that there is a test in most stories. What good is declaring love if no further action is required? As for all dying in Adam, I suppose that if we didn’t that there would be no remedy for those who sinned, only the perfect would live. As for old mythology being used to stagnate us nothing could be so used if we didn’t have a problem within ourselves. Surely no one is prepared to say that they are perfectly innocent and have only been harmed by someone else out there? Peter’s comment makes me think of C.S. Lewis’s notion that the myths were forunners of the true fantastic story of Christ.What language is that?
#8 by Mark on 05/16/2006 - 10:09 pm
“As for all dying in Adam, I suppose that if we didn’t that there would be no remedy for those who sinned, only the perfect would live.”
Isn’t that exactly what christianity teaches will happen after the battle of armageddon? ONly those who are raised up by god to live in Adamic perfection for eternity? Dying in Adam is still a silly idea no matter how you look at it.
#9 by Mark on 05/16/2006 - 11:29 pm
Bob, what I find amusing about the OT tree of life story, is the way the serpent (who was supposedly Adam’s first wife, Lillith according to ancient Judaism but later changed to the devil per christianity) told the truth to Eve while god lied to her and Adam. If you remember, god said that the day Adam and Eve eat of the fruit they would die, while the serpent told them they wouldn’t die and instead their eyes would be opened and they would be like god, knowing good from evil.
#10 by Dennis on 05/17/2006 - 6:30 am
It is all a matter of interpretation.
In Genesis I think the lesson is that with knowledge comes pain. Interesting to note, that it was the eating of the tree of knowledge which caused women to have labour pains. The reason that childbith in humans is so painful, is due to the size of the brain. I also personally believe that the more intelligent the creature, the more they feel the pains and troubles of life. None are more so aware of the problems of being a mortal being, than those who have the highest awareness.
Prometheus created man, but because he was unable to give his creation fur, claws and wings, people shivered in the cold. Feeling sorry for them, he stole fire from the gods after Zeus’s disapproval. For this he was punished. It appears he was punished more for theft, than for bringing humans light. It is important to note that Prometheus was a rebel, who rebelled against the gods by wanting to give men more power than they would allow and given the choice between pleasing the gods and giving men light, he gave man light
#11 by Elizabeth on 05/18/2006 - 10:55 am
There’s a very interesting book by a man named Callaham — I
think it’s called THE SECRET HISTORY OF THE BIBLE —
in which he does a very thorough job of tracing the historical
roots of the parts of the Bible, as well as the history of
Judaism, along the way. He concludes that the Jehovah
of Genesis is COMPLETELY different from the God of Daniel,
that Judaism as it is now did not exist before the Babylonian
Exile. (Babylon’s next door to Iran.)
Before that, Jehovah was the head of a pantheon of Gods
and human sacrifice was part of Judaism.